Episode 47 of The SitePoint Podcast is now available! This week your hosts are Patrick O’Keefe (@ifroggy), Stephan Segraves (@ssegraves), Brad Williams (@williamsba), and Kevin Yank (@sentience).

SitePoint Podcast的 第47集现已发布！ 本周的主持人是Patrick O'Keefe( @ifroggy )，Stephan Segraves( @ssegraves )，Brad Williams( @williamsba )和Kevin Yank( @sentience )。

下载此剧集 (Download this Episode)

You can also download this episode as a standalone MP3 file. Here’s the link:

您也可以将本集下载为独立的MP3文件。 这是链接：

• SitePoint Podcast #47: Checkmate Apple (MP3, 45.1MB)

  SitePoint Podcast＃47：Checkmate苹果 (MP3，45.1MB)

剧集摘要 (Episode Summary)

Here are the topics covered in this episode:

以下是本集中介绍的主题：

Google Chrome Extensions Go Live

Google Chrome扩展程序上线

• New Google Chrome Release Adds Support For 1,500+ Extensions, Bookmark Sync (TechCrunch)

  新的Google Chrome版本增加了对1,500多个扩展程序，书签同步 (TechCrunch)的支持

Google dropping support for non-modern browsers come March 1st, 2010

Google将于2010年3月1日停止对非现代浏览器的支持

• Google Apps Drop IE6 Support (SitePoint)

  Google Apps Drop IE6支持 (SitePoint)

• Modern browsers for modern applications (Official Google Enterprise Blog)

  适用于现代应用程序的现代浏览器 (Google企业博客官方)

Apple claims iPad will offer the best web browsing experience available

苹果声称iPad将提供最佳的网络浏览体验

• iPad Features (Apple)

  iPad功能 (Apple)

• Apple’s iPad — a broken link? (Adobe)

  苹果的iPad –链接断开了吗？ (Adobe)

• The iPad provides the ultimate browsing experience? (The Flash Blog)

  iPad提供了终极的浏览体验？ (Flash博客)

• Do you really need Flash for the Web? (Kendall Helmstetter Gelner)

  您是否真的需要Web Flash？ (肯德尔·赫尔姆斯特·盖尔纳)

• We don’t need Flash on the iPad, we need better tools to build HTML5 sites (dasflash)

  我们在iPad上不需要Flash，我们需要更好的工具来构建HTML5网站 (dasflash)

• Who Can Do Something About Those Blue Boxes? (Daring Fireball)

  谁可以对那些蓝框做些什么？ (火星人)

• Sympathy for the Devil (John Nack)

  对魔鬼的同情 (约翰·纳克)

Host Spotlights:

主持人聚光灯：

• Stephan: Sublime Video

  斯蒂芬： 崇高的视频

• Brad: What Browser?

  布拉德： 什么浏览器？

• Kevin: SitePoint CSS Reference

  凯文： SitePoint CSS参考

• Patrick: Calculating Charlie Brown’s Wins, Losses, & Other Stats

  帕特里克： 计算查理·布朗的获胜，亏损和其他数据

显示成绩单 (Show Transcript)

Kevin: February 5th, 2010. Chrome extensions go mainstream. Google drops IE6 and what the iPad means for the future of Flash. I’m Kevin Yank and this is the SitePoint podcast #47: Checkmate Apple.

凯文： 2010年2月5日。Chrome扩展程序已成为主流。 Google放弃了IE6，以及iPad对Flash的未来意味着什么。 我是Kevin Yank，这是SitePoint播客＃47：Checkmate苹果。

And we are all back together again—all four of us! It’s been—I don’t know how many episodes—at least five since we’ve had the whole crew together.

我们又回到了一起，就是我们四个人！ 自从我们将全体工作人员召集在一起以来，至少有五集是不知道的。

We’ve got Patrick O’Keefe from the iFroggy network. Hi, Patrick.

我们已经从iFroggy网络获得了Patrick O'Keefe。 嗨，帕特里克

Patrick: Hello.

帕特里克：你好。

Kevin: Holding down the fort very nicely in my absence. Thank you for that.

凯文：在我不在的时候很好地按住了堡垒。 谢谢你

Patrick: Thank you.

帕特里克：谢谢。

Kevin: And Brad Williams from WebDev Studios. How’s it going?

凯文：还有WebDev Studios的Brad Williams。 怎么样了？

Brad: Howdy.

布拉德：你好。

Kevin: You had the week off our last panel show, isn’t that right?

凯文：您在我们上一次的专题讨论会上放了一周时间，不是吗？

Brad: I think so. That was what … a month ago?

布拉德：我是这样认为的。 那是……一个月前？

Kevin: I can’t keep track of your travels. You’ve been all over the place.

凯文：我无法追踪你的旅行。 你到处都是。

Brad: It’s all blending together at this point.

布拉德：此时一切都融合在一起了。

Kevin: And Stephan Segraves from Houston, Texas. How is it going, Steven?

凯文：还有得克萨斯州休斯顿的斯蒂芬·塞格雷夫斯。 怎么样，史蒂文？

Stephan: Pretty good. I’d say “howdy” but Brad took that from me.

史蒂芬：很好。 我会说“你好”，但布拉德从我那儿拿走了。

All: (laughter)

全部：(笑声)

Patrick: Ohhh boy.

帕特里克：哦，男孩。

Kevin: Stephan and I are excited about this show, I think it’s safe to say because it’s all about iPad. The entire Web, for the past week, it’s been iPad, iPad, iPad. Apple sure knows how to steal the spotlight. Stephan and I are fans of a lot of things they do.

凯文：史蒂芬(Stephan)和我对此节目感到兴奋，我认为可以肯定地说，因为这全都与iPad有关。 在过去的一周中，整个网络一直是iPad，iPad，iPad。 苹果肯定知道如何抢眼。 我和斯蒂芬(Stephan)都是他们做的很多事情的粉丝。

Stephan, are you ready for some iPad chat today?

斯蒂芬，你准备好今天进行一些iPad聊天吗？

Stephan: Yeah, I’m ready to hear what the other guys have to say too.

斯蒂芬：是的，我已经准备好听听其他人也要说些什么。

Kevin: You’ve watched the keynote, I assume.

凯文：我想你已经看过主题演讲。

Stephan: I did.

史蒂芬：我做到了。

Kevin: Good. Good.

凯文：好。 好。

But before we get to that, there’s a few other stories to check in with. First of all, something we’ve spoken about a few times before was Google Chrome and specifically, extensions support in Google Chrome. This past week, we hear that Google Chrome for Windows has had a major update which adds official support for extensions. It’s been beta only, up until now.

但是在我们开始之前，还有一些其他故事需要检查。 首先，我们之前讨论过几次，就是Google Chrome，特别是Google Chrome中的扩展程序支持。 在过去的一周中，我们听说Google Chrome浏览器Windows版进行了重大更新，增加了对扩展程序的官方支持。 到目前为止，它只是beta版。

We were a little confused about that the last time we discussed it. I don’t think we’re the only ones; they’ve had a big extensions site up for awhile now but apparently it’s only been available to people running in the beta updates stream but now the official version of Google Chrome for Windows has full support for extensions and also they’ve added bookmark sync in there, which I found surprising. The bookmark management features of the app continue to be under whelming for me but at least I can sync those bookmarks to every other computer I work on.

我们上次讨论它时感到有些困惑。 我不认为我们是唯一的。 他们已经建立了一个大型扩展站点已有一段时间了，但显然只有在Beta更新流中运行的用户才能使用，但现在Google Chrome for Windows的正式版已完全支持扩展，并且他们还添加了书签同步功能在那里，我感到惊讶。 该应用程序的书签管理功能继续困扰着我，但至少我可以将这些书签同步到我使用的其他每台计算机上。

Stephan: With the bookmark feature, is it— I’m kind of out of loop about this. It seems like a cool feature to me, but as someone who doesn’t really need the syncing, is it something that other browsers are offering right now and how does that compare to the other offerings?

史蒂芬(Stephan)：有了书签功能，对此我有点不了解。 对我来说，这似乎是一项很酷的功能，但是作为真正不需要同步的人，其他浏览器现在是否正在提供该功能，与其他产品相比又有什么不同？

Kevin: It’s been available as an add-on definitely for Firefox. There’s been a few bookmarks syncing extensions as well as things like the Delicious extension that will just replace the browser’s bookmark system with your Delicious account. And certainly Mozilla has been working on just a sort of a general platform for syncing browser related data across all of your computers, not just your bookmarks but also things like history and passwords and cookies and all that sort of stuff.

凯文：它确实是Firefox的附加组件。 已经有一些书签同步扩展，还有Delicious扩展之类的东西，它们只会用您的Delicious帐户替换浏览器的书签系统。 当然，Mozilla一直在开发一种通用平台，用于在您所有计算机上同步与浏览器相关的数据 ，不仅包括书签，还包括历史记录，密码和cookie以及诸如此类的东西。

So it’s a step along the road that other browsers are threading but it’s early in the life of the browser, I think. This is kind of a niche feature. Are there really that many people out there that will be running Google Chrome in more than one place?

因此，我认为这是其他浏览器正在线程化的道路上的一步，但这是浏览器生命周期的早期。 这是一种利基功能。 真的有很多人可以在多个地方运行Google Chrome吗？

Brad: I do. Maybe I’m the minority, I don’t know. Extensions were a long time coming. I think you’re right, Kevin, we did discuss this, I think, about a month ago, that it was announced that extension support was coming to the stable version and then it just never happened. Because I would literally was on the site every day waiting for it to happen and it never did. And there was never really an announcement on what happened but anyways, they delayed it. They finally released 4.0. It’s out and I’m hoping now because even the extension library on the website where you can kind of surf through and see what they have, there isn’t a whole lot in it. So I’m hoping now that it’s in the stable version supports extensions that more developers will get involved and actually create some…

布拉德：我知道。 也许我是少数，我不知道。 扩展很长时间了。 我认为您是对的，Kevin，我们确实在讨论此问题，大约一个月前，我们宣布已将扩展支持发布到稳定版本，但从未实现过。 因为从字面上看，我每天都会在站点上等待它的发生，但是从来没有。 从来没有真正宣布发生过什么事，但是无论如何，他们都推迟了。 他们终于发布了4.0。 完了，我现在希望，因为即使是网站上的扩展库，您也可以浏览并查看扩展库，里面没有很多东西。 因此，我现在希望它处于稳定版本中，它支持扩展，以便更多开发人员参与其中并实际创建一些…

Kevin: Wait, wait, wait, wait—I’m reading the TechCrunch story here and it says there’s 1,500+ extensions available. Are you telling me there’s nothing in there?

凯文：等等，等等，等等，我在这里读TechCrunch的故事 ，它说有1500多个扩展可用。 你是在告诉我那里什么都没有吗？

Brad: Wait, there might be a 1,000 and some but I’m telling you there’s nothing that really… there’s a couple that caught my eye, but a lot of them don’t really—they don’t interest me and I don’t know if it’s just me but it doesn’t—and maybe it’s because I’m used to specific Firefox add-ons and I haven’t seen those pop up yet.

布拉德：等等，可能有1000个，但我告诉你没有什么真正的……有一对吸引我的目光，但是其中许多对我并不感兴趣，他们对我不感兴趣，我也不不知道是否只有我一个人，但事实并非如此，这也许是因为我已经习惯了特定的Firefox附加组件，而且还没有看到这些附加组件。

Kevin: So is it just cluttered with people going, oh, my first extension.

凯文：那是不是有人忙乱了，哦，我的第一个扩展。

Brad: It’s a lot of that.

布拉德：很多。

Kevin: Displays ‘hello, world’ on browser launch.

凯文：在浏览器启动时显示“世界你好”。

Brad: There’s a lot of real basic ones like NFL scores, NBA scores, news from this site, news from that site—stuff that you can get from regular RSS reader anyways. There’s also a lot of Google specific extensions. Quick hooks into Gmail and a Google URL shortener and Google translate integration, a lot of things like that. I’m really waiting for that Firebug extension to show up, so hopefully that’s in the works.

布拉德：有很多真实的基础知识，例如NFL得分，NBA得分，来自该站点的新闻，来自该站点的新闻-无论如何，您都可以从常规RSS阅读器中获得这些东西。 还有很多Google特定的扩展程序。 快速连接Gmail和Google URL缩短器以及Google翻译集成，诸如此类。 我真的在等待该Firebug扩展的出现，所以希望它正在开发中。

Kevin: The funny thing I just noticed is that the number one most popular Google Chrome extension is Xmarks Bookmarks Sync.

凯文：我刚刚注意到的有趣的事情是，最受欢迎的Google Chrome扩展程序中排名第一的是Xmarks Bookmarks Sync 。

I don’t know if Google is just paying attention to the most popular extension and adding that feature to each release of its browser but yeah, when the most popular extension in your library has just been obsoleted by your latest release, I’m not sure that’s a healthy extensions community.

我不知道Google是否只是在关注最受欢迎的扩展并将其添加到其浏览器的每个版本中，但是，是的，当您的库中最受欢迎的扩展刚刚被您的最新版本所取代时，我不是确保这是一个健康的扩展社区。

No doubt the official release of the support will prompt a few more developers to build something a little more meaty. So I’m sure we can look forward to some Firefox-style, really game changing extensions for his browser soon.

无疑，支持的正式发布将促使更多的开发人员构建更多功能。 因此，我敢肯定，我们很快就会为他的浏览器提供一些Firefox风格的，真正改变游戏规则的扩展程序。

Stephan: But it blows my mind that they’re lagging so much in the Mac browser behind what they’re doing on the Windows browser.

斯蒂芬：但是我很震惊，因为它们在Mac浏览器中远远落后于Windows浏览器。

Kevin: Well, that’s it; the Linux version of Google Chrome’s extensions are still for the beta release only and the Mac version is only beta right now. Or no, did they release a full version?

凯文：好，就是这样。 Linux版本的Google Chrome浏览器扩展程序仍仅用于beta版本，而Mac版本目前仅是beta版本。 还是不，他们发布了完整版本吗？

Stephan: I haven’t seen a full version, no.

史蒂芬：我还没有看完整版，不是。

Kevin: In any case, extensions are only available for Mac developers running the developer preview, the super unstable version of the browser. So, yeah, they’re still way behind and they’re asking Mac users to hang tight but I don’t know if the Mac version will always be last in line or if they’re planning to sync them up at some point? I guess we’ll find out.

凯文：无论如何，扩展程序仅适用于运行开发人员预览版(浏览器的超级不稳定版本)的Mac开发人员。 所以，是的，他们仍然落后，要求Mac用户保持稳定，但我不知道Mac版本是否将永远排在最后，或者他们是否打算在某个时候同步它们？ 我想我们会找出答案的。

Well, our next story is also related to Google and they are dropping support for older browsers, including older versions of Chrome, I noticed. Starting March 1st, Internet Explorer 6 users are going to be out of luck because Google is no longer going to be guaranteeing that their web applications will work in older browsers like IE6, anything earlier than Firefox 3, anything earlier than Chrome 4 and anything earlier than Safari 3, which I found was the most generous one.

好吧，我们的下一个故事也与Google有关，我注意到它们正在放弃对旧版浏览器(包括旧版Chrome)的支持。 从3月1日开始，Internet Explorer 6用户将失去运气，因为Google不再保证其Web应用程序将在IE6，Firefox 3之前的版本，Chrome 4之前的版本以及Chrome 4之前的版本等旧浏览器中运行。比我发现的Safari 3最为慷慨。

I’d say anyone running Safari these days would have to be on Safari 4 unless they are running a rather old operating system on their Mac.

我想说，如今运行Safari的任何人都必须使用Safari 4，除非他们在Mac上运行的是相当老的操作系统。

They’re saying that starting March 1st, new releases, particularly of the Google Docs and Sites apps will be dropping support for these older browsers and simply won’t be working well, if at all, in non-modern browsers.

他们说，从3月1日开始，新版本(尤其是Google Docs和Sites应用程序)将不再支持这些旧版本的浏览器，并且即使在非现代浏览器中也无法正常运行。

I think a lot of us have wanted to do this in our own work. Is Google giving us that permission?

我认为我们很多人都想在自己的工作中做到这一点。 Google是否授予我们该许可？

Brad: Yes. I’ve been pretty vocal about it and I’ve actually at our company, we dropped IE6 support a while ago. We’ll certainly do it but there is obviously an additional fee associated with that. But this, I think you made a great point, Kevin; this helps justify…

布拉德：是的。 我一直在大声疾呼，实际上我在我们公司工作，不久前我们放弃了IE6支持。 我们当然会这样做，但是显然要为此付出额外的费用。 但是，我认为你说的很对，凯文。 这有助于证明…

Kevin: Let me stop you there though. I’m really interested. Is that something—is that an optional extra that your clients tend to take up or do they go, oh, yeah, you’re right, we can probably do without it.

凯文：不过我让你停在那里。 我真的很感兴趣 是这样吗？是您的客户倾向于选择的还是他们愿意去的可选附加产品，哦，是的，您是对的，我们可能会没有它。

Brad: Most don’t. Most smaller sites don’t take it up. Now, the larger clients—sure, they want it to work on every browser that’s ever been created and they usually will. But we’re very upfront about it. We tell them and we explain the reasoning behind it. But I think like you said. This does help our company and many others out there like it, to justify what we’re doing. It says look, now Google is also taking the same stand that we are. So it’s not just my company trying to take the easy way out and not work on IE6.

布拉德：大多数都不是。 大多数较小的网站都不会使用它。 现在，大型客户可以肯定的是，他们希望它能在曾经创建过的每种浏览器上都能正常工作。 但是，我们对此非常提前。 我们告诉他们，并解释其背后的原因。 但是我想就像你说的那样。 这确实可以帮助我们的公司和其他许多公司证明自己在做什么。 它说，看起来，现在Google也采取了与我们相同的立场。 因此，不仅仅是我的公司试图采取简单的方法而不是在IE6上工作。

It’s just like Google says, a lot of it is because it’s lacking features and you really have to jump through hoops to get IE6 do certain things that you really shouldn’t have to do. I’m sure everybody’s out there cheering when we first saw the blog post, it was a nice moment. And obviously, it’s not just going to stop overnight but at least it’s a step in the right direction.

就像Google所说的那样，很大一部分是因为它缺少功能，您真的必须跳过障碍才能让IE6做一些您本不应该做的事情。 我敢肯定，当我们第一次看到博客文章时，每个人都会为之欢呼，这是一个美好的时刻。 显然，这不仅会在一夜之间停止，而且至少是朝正确方向迈出的一步。

Kevin: Absolutely. I wonder though if corporations are moving to things like Google Docs as their primary office suite. So if they’re dropping things like Microsoft Office and going for the free option where that make sense.

凯文：是的 。 我不知道公司是否将Google Docs等作为主要办公套件。 因此，如果他们要放弃Microsoft Office之类的东西，并在合理的地方选择免费选项。

I wonder if that was a way of getting out of paying for an upgrade for Microsoft Office and now staying with Google Docs is going to require them to pay for an upgrade to, well, Microsoft Windows in many cases or at least pay their IT staff to deploy a new version of Internet Explorer. I wonder if their cost-dodging efforts are now going to make them take a second look at Google Apps and go, well, no, that’s not quite as attractive as we were hoping, maybe we’ll go back to Microsoft Office.

我想知道这是否是摆脱支付Microsoft Office升级费用的一种方式，而现在留在Google Docs中会要求他们在很多情况下为升级到Microsoft Windows支付费用，或者至少付给IT人员部署新版本的Internet Explorer。 我想知道他们现在是否在努力降低成本，以使他们重新审视Google Apps，然后走，嗯，不，这没有我们希望的那么吸引人，也许我们会回到Microsoft Office。

Has the strength of Google Docs been at least in the corporate market that you can run it on all the browsers and they don’t have to deploy a software platform upgrade? It’s what I’m wondering.

至少在企业市场上，您可以在所有浏览器上运行Google Docs，而不必部署软件平台升级吗？ 这就是我想知道的。

Brad: Yeah, I’d love to see some numbers on that because I saw couple of articles kind of call that out and it’s hard to say exactly—I mean, you would think it would be a very, very, very small percentage but I’m sure there are people that are using IE6 and Google Docs on a daily basis. I just don’t have any pity for companies really depending on IE6 at this point. I mean, they’ve known years ago that it’s hated among the development community and it’s very hard to work with and they haven’t made the effort to get off of IE6 at this point? I mean it’s 2010.

布拉德：是的，我很乐意看到一些数字，因为我看到几篇文章都这么说了，而且很难确切地说出-我的意思是，你会认为这将是一个非常非常非常小的百分比，但是我敢肯定有人每天都在使用IE6和Google文档。 在这一点上，我只是对真正依赖IE6的公司没有任何可惜。 我的意思是，他们早在几年前就已经知道开发社区对此感到讨厌，并且很难与之合作，并且他们现在还没有努力摆脱IE6吗？ 我的意思是2010年。

Stephan: Not to mention security holes you know.

斯蒂芬：更不用说您知道的安全漏洞了。

Kevin: Well yeah!

凯文：是的！

Stephan: I mean, why not jump on that back when we were having all the security issues and update IE6 then? So now it’s becoming more and more apparent; eventually, everybody’s going to start dropping support for IE6 and then they’re going to be really be up the creek without a paddle.

史蒂芬：我的意思是，当我们遇到所有安全问题并随后更新IE6时，为什么不跳回去呢？ 因此，现在它变得越来越明显。 最终，每个人​​都将开始放弃对IE6的支持，然后他们将真是一without而就。

Kevin: Well, you’ve got your web developers telling you to upgrade, you’ve got Microsoft telling you to upgrade, you’ve got now the German government telling you to upgrade, and now Google is telling you— forcing you to upgrade if you want to keep using their software. I think if you’re ignoring the signs now, I think you’re right, I don’t have a lot of pity for them either, Brad.

凯文：嗯，您的Web开发人员告诉您升级，您让Microsoft告诉您升级，现在德国政府告诉您进行升级，现在Google告诉您- 强迫您进行升级。如果您想继续使用他们的软件。 我认为如果您现在忽略这些迹象，我认为您是对的，布拉德，我也不会对他们感到遗憾。

Brad: I do think it’s funny that you point out that Google says it’ll support Chrome 4.0+.

布拉德：我确实很有趣，您指出Google表示它将支持Chrome 4.0+。

Kevin: Well, yeah.

凯文：恩，是的。

Brad: So basically a month and a half after—two months after the 4 came out that that’s the only browser they’re supporting. I think it’s odd.

布拉德：所以基本上是一个半月之后-4发行后两个月，那是他们唯一支持的浏览器。 我觉得很奇怪。

Kevin: Yeah. I guess they don’t like their older work.

凯文：是的。 我猜他们不喜欢他们以前的工作。

So let’s dive into it guys. Apple last week announced the iPad, its new tablet computer based on the operating system and software platform of the iPhone and the iPod touch, it’s going to run a browser very similar to the Mobile Safari browser that you get on your iPhone except it’s going to be on a big, biggish 10-inch screen, and Apple is claiming right up front—it’s their top selling line on their features page for the iPad—that the iPad will provide the best web browsing experience available. And yet, no Flash support because obviously, Mobile Safari on iPhone and iPod touch has no plug-in support. There just simply isn’t an API for extending that browser and so it’s coming to the iPad with those same restrictions and therefore, no Java plug-in, no Flash plug-in, whatever other esoteric plug-in you might rely on is not going to be there.

因此，让我们深入研究吧。 苹果上周发布了iPad，这是一款基于iPhone和iPod touch的操作系统和软件平台的新型平板电脑，它将运行与您在iPhone上获得的Mobile Safari浏览器非常相似的浏览器，除了在10英寸大的大型屏幕上，苹果公司就宣称iPad将提供最佳的网络浏览体验，这是他们在iPad功能页面上的最畅销产品。 但是，没有Flash支持，因为很明显，iPhone和iPod touch上的Mobile Safari没有插件支持。 只是没有一个用于扩展该浏览器的API，因此它以相同的限制进入iPad，因此，没有Java插件，没有Flash插件，您可能依赖的其他任何深奥插件都不会会在那里。

Does the iPad provide the ultimate browser experience? That’s my question. Adobe is hoping that people are going to read its marketing saying no, there’s no Flash on this thing. It’s not the best browser experience and therefore people won’t buy it and that will force Apple’s hand to open up its platform to Flash. But is that going to happen?

iPad是否提供终极的浏览器体验？ 那是我的问题。 Adobe希望人们能读懂其营销方式，说不，这件事上没有Flash。 它不是最佳的浏览器体验，因此人们不会购买它，这将迫使苹果公司的手向Flash开放其平台。 但这会发生吗？

Patrick: So is this the best way to experience the Web or is it the best way to experience the App Store? It seems like we might have the biggest, most pretty App Store in the land especially Apple App Store but the Flash thing is it’s going to bother people and I don’t think the iPad is going to suffer necessarily but it certainly leaves an opening in the market for someone else, maybe HP with the Windows equivalent, to come in and provide Flash support on a tablet device.

帕特里克：那么这是体验网络的最佳方式还是体验App Store的最佳方式？ 看起来我们可能拥有世界上最大，最漂亮的App Store，尤其是Apple App Store，但Flash的问题是它会打扰人们，而且我认为iPad不一定会遭受损失，但肯定会给其他市场(也许是配备Windows的惠普)在平板设备上提供Flash支持的市场。

Kevin: I know within six months of the launch of this thing, I will not miss Flash on this device because as we saw with the iPhone, any site that people want to use on that device is going to be updated with HTML 5 video and other— an iPhone specific version of the site where that makes sense. Or if the site does something that is really beyond what you can achieve on that type of browser, they’re going to write their own iPhone app. So I think we’re going to see the same pattern follow the release of the iPad and therefore, for myself, for an early adopter technology-minded user, within six months of the launch of this thing, I’m not going to miss Flash in the web browsing experience.

凯文(Kevin)：我知道在发布该产品的六个月内，我不会错过该设备上的Flash，因为正如我们在iPhone上看到的那样，人们想要在该设备上使用的任何网站都将使用HTML 5视频和其他-有意义的网站特定于iPhone的版本。 或者，如果该网站所做的事情实际上超出了您在那种浏览器上所能实现的范围，那么他们将编写自己的iPhone应用程序。 因此，我认为我们将在iPad发行后看到相同的模式，因此，对于我自己来说，对于具有早期采用技术的用户来说，在发行此产品后的六个月内，我不会错过闪现Web浏览体验。

Stephan, it sounds like you have the same feeling.

斯蒂芬，听起来你有同样的感觉。

Stephan: Yeah. You know, I miss Flash on my iPhone a little bit and it’s just because of the way I use it and what I do. I like to look up restaurants and things and some of those restaurants, actually, a lot of restaurants have Flash-based websites. I don’t know why, and it really annoys me when I’m trying to look at the menu or something and I can’t because the website is in Flash. I don’t think I’ll have that problem with the iPad though just because I don’t think I’m going to use it that way. I’m not going to be looking up restaurants on the go with my iPad. It’s a different user experience, it’s a different methodology of using the iPad than using iPhone and I don’t see the need, I really don’t, and I’ll get to another reason later on the show.

斯蒂芬：是的。 您知道，我有点想念iPhone上的Flash，这仅仅是因为我使用它的方式以及所做的事情。 我喜欢查找餐厅和事物，其中一些餐厅实际上是很多餐厅都有基于Flash的网站。 我不知道为什么，当我尝试查看菜单或其他内容时，这确实让我很烦，但我不能，因为该网站位于Flash中。 我不认为iPad会有这个问题，尽管只是因为我认为我不会那样使用它。 我不会用iPad在旅途中查找餐馆。 这是一种不同的用户体验，它是使用iPad而不是使用iPhone的不同方法，我没有看到需求，我真的没有，在稍后的节目中，我将介绍另一个原因。

Kevin: Well, that brings up a good point. What is Flash used for? It’s used by hoity-toity restaurant sites. It’s used by movie sites, when you see a movie trailer, the URL at the end is often pointing to an all Flash website. So you’re not going to be able to experience previews to the latest movies on these devices.

凯文：好吧，这很有意义。 Flash的用途是什么？ 旅馆餐厅网站使用它。 电影网站使用它，当您看到电影预告片时，末尾的URL通常指向全Flash网站。 因此，您将无法在这些设备上体验最新电影的预览。

Is there anything else people can think of?

人们还能想到什么？

Patrick: Video, games, it depends on how you use it I think is how much you’ll miss it but I think that’s a good point. And this is where the point that John Gruber at Daring Fireball made is the companies, the developers, they don’t really care about anybody but themselves and their customers. So they don’t necessarily care about Adobe or Apple but if there’s a sizable audience that’s using the iPad, then they’ll make their sites work well with the iPad. It’s the same as mobile browsing. If it has mobile visitors, a lot of mobile traffic, then they invest in creating a mobile site or have it work well with a mobile device. The same thing will happen here. I think the smaller budget operations are probably the ones that won’t be able to adjust or will be very slow to adjust but as far as the average large game site, large video site, Hulu, etc., I mean I expect that they’ll adjust and get ready to be viewed on the iPad.

帕特里克：视频，游戏，取决于您的使用方式，我想您会想念它的多少，但是我认为这是个好主意。 这就是Daring Fireball的John Gruber提出的要点，是公司，开发人员，他们实际上并不关心任何人，而是他们自己和客户。 因此，他们不一定在乎Adobe或Apple，但如果有相当多的观众在使用iPad，那么他们将使他们的网站与iPad一起正常工作。 与移动浏览相同。 如果它有移动访客，大量的移动流量，那么他们会投资创建一个移动站点或使其与移动设备很好地兼容。 同样的事情会在这里发生。 我认为较小的预算操作可能是无法调整的，或者调整速度将非常缓慢，但就一般大型游戏网站，大型视频网站，Hulu等而言，我的意思是我希望它们将进行调整并准备好在iPad上进行查看。

Kevin: So here we have a chicken and egg situation where if the iPad is successful and has a big market, the developers will necessarily accommodate them but will the user base come if the experience on day one is not the best? I think what happened with the iPhone was lucky because people were buying it as a phone. And yes, it had a really nice web browser on it but what drew the initial ground swell of user base to that device was the phone. And then web developers wanted to target those phone users with their web apps… great.

凯文(Kevin)：因此，在这里我们遇到了麻烦，如果iPad成功并拥有大市场，开发人员一定会适应它们，但是如果第一天的体验不是最好的，用户群会来吗？ 我认为iPhone发生的事很幸运，因为人们将其作为电话购买。 是的，它上面有一个非常漂亮的Web浏览器，但手机吸引了最初的用户群。 然后，Web开发人员希望通过其Web应用程序来定位那些电话用户。

On the iPad, what’s going to draw people to that device, if anything, on day one which six months down the line will create a market that web developers want to chase? Is it the apps, is it the bookstore, is it the office suite that you can control with your fingers?

在iPad上，什么吸引人们使用该设备(如果有的话)，在生产线开始六个月的第一天，将创建一个Web开发人员想要追逐的市场？ 是应用程序，还是书店，还是可以用手指控制的办公套件？

Well, that’s the question. I think Apple is betting that it’s just the coolness factor of Apple’s new device and maybe that is enough. Maybe that’s all it’ll take. I know that’s half the reason I’m buying it.

好吧，这就是问题。 我认为苹果押注这仅仅是苹果新设备的凉爽因素，也许就足够了。 也许仅此而已。 我知道那是我购买它的一半原因。

Patrick: Right. I think that’s a fair point. I think that it’s going to be a good browsing device, something that you’ll check email on browse the web and kind of a lightweight thing for how some people use a laptop even. You know lighter laptop users might find it as an acceptable substitute, something that’ll be lighter and easier to carry and you know the coolness of Apple is certainly a big part of it and I don’t foresee it having any problems because of the Flash thing. Does that does not mean people won’t buy it I think on day one? Well, I mean, I see plenty of people commenting that they’re going to wait for the second generation and I think there’s a lot of people that’ll feel that way not because of the Flash issue even but just because of the perception that first generation devices and you have some kinks that need to be worked out whether it’d be Apple or someone else.

帕特里克：对。 我认为这是一个公平的观点。 我认为这将是一个很好的浏览设备，您可以在浏览网络时检查电子邮件，这对于某些人甚至使用笔记本电脑来说都是一种轻巧的东西。 您知道更轻便的笔记本电脑用户可能会认为它是可以接受的替代品，它会更轻便，更易于携带，并且您知道Apple的凉爽肯定是它的重要组成部分，并且我不认为它会带来任何问题，因为闪光的东西。 我认为第一天人们就不会购买吗？ 好吧，我的意思是，我看到很多人都在评论说他们将等待第二代产品，而且我认为很多人会觉得这种感觉不是因为Flash问题，而是因为人们认为第一代设备，无论是Apple还是其他公司，您都需要解决一些问题。

I think a lot of people will just wait till the second generation but the coolness of Apple products probably cannot be underestimated.

我认为很多人会等到第二代产品，但苹果产品的凉爽程度可能不会被低估。

Stephan: The Safari browser, the Mobile Safari browser that they built for the iPhone and for the iPad, it’s awesome. I mean I don’t think there’s any other way to say it and it’s fast, it’s renders quickly. It’s a good browser. So, I think people’s browsing experiences are going to be good.

斯蒂芬： Safari浏览器，这是他们为iPhone和iPad建造的Mobile Safari浏览器，它很棒。 我的意思是，我认为没有别的说法可以这么说，而且速度很快，渲染速度很快。 这是一个很好的浏览器。 因此，我认为人们的浏览体验将会很好。

Kevin: And by all reports, the fact that the iPad has a 1GHz processor in it makes that fast browser incredibly faster. Like, it’s a phone operating system and a phone browser running on something closer to a desktop hardware platform, and rather than add stuff to take advantage of that hardware grunt, at least in the first version, they’ve pretty much gone barebones with the feature set and as a result, this thing screams from what I’ve read.

凯文：据所有报道，iPad内置1GHz处理器的事实使这种快速的浏览器更快。 例如，它是一个电话操作系统和一个电话浏览器，它们在更接近桌面硬件平台的位置上运行，而不是添加某些东西来利用硬件的苦恼，至少在第一个版本中，它们几乎已经成为准系统。功能集，结果，这件事使我所读的内容大为震惊。

Stephan: Yeah, and if you look at who they target and who goes into an Apple store—walk in to an Apple store and look at who’s there, it’s a lot of kids—and how many sites do they go to that have Flash, nowadays.

斯蒂芬：是的，如果您查看目标对象和谁进入Apple商店-走进Apple商店并查看谁在那儿，那是很多孩子-以及他们要访问多少个拥有Flash的网站，如今。

Kevin: That’s a good point. That’s a good point. If we’re talking about who’s going to buy it, it’s the experience they’re going to have going in to this store, they’re going to go, “Ooh! Here’s this device. Will it do what I want to do on the Web?”

凯文：这是一个好点。 那是个很好的观点。 如果我们要说的是谁去买，那是他们进入这家商店的经验，他们会去，“哦！ 这是这个设备。 它会做我想在网络上做的事情吗？”

They’ll play with it. They may load two or three sites and then, if it does what they want, they’ll take it home. So, what sites are they going to load? Maybe they’ll load YouTube and that’ll work well.

他们会玩的。 他们可能会加载两个或三个站点，然后，如果它能满足他们的要求，他们会将其带回家。 那么，它们将要加载哪些站点？ 也许他们会加载YouTube，并且效果很好。

Stephan: Facebook.

史蒂芬： Facebook。

Kevin: Facebook I think is a big one. Facebook has a nice iPhone experience but I suspect that on the iPad they’re just going to go with the default site because the only reason they did the iPhone specific site is because of screen real estate. I think the standard Facebook site will live very happily on the iPad screen but there are Facebook users and there are Facebook gamers.

凯文：我认为Facebook非常重要。 Facebook拥有不错的iPhone体验，但我怀疑在iPad上它们只会使用默认站点，因为他们选择iPhone特定站点的唯一原因是屏幕空间。 我认为标准的Facebook网站会在iPad屏幕上非常愉快地运行，但是有Facebook用户和Facebook游戏玩家。

I know there are people that only log in to Facebook these days— yeah, for Farmville!

我知道有些人这些天只登录Facebook –是的，对于Farmville！

Farmville is a Flash app and it’s not going to work. And there is no Farmville iPhone app. Short of them releasing a Farmville iPad app to replace the Facebook one—I could think of worst things for them to do. Short of them doing that, it’s not going to sell to the Farmville set. Are there any other big user group amongst the regular users out there who’re going to be put off by this device? I don’t think so.

Farmville是Flash应用程序，无法正常工作。 而且没有Farmville iPhone应用程序。 缺少他们发布的Farmville iPad应用程序来替代Facebook，我想不到他们要做的最糟糕的事情。 如果他们不这样做，它就不会卖给Farmville公司。 除了普通用户之外，还有其他大用户群会被此设备推迟吗？ 我不这么认为。

Patrick: I think if Apple is smart, they’re going to make these deals, if they’re not already made, to work on the Apple devices. They’ve already got YouTube app right on the iPad homepage.

帕特里克(Patrick)：我认为，如果苹果公司很聪明，他们将进行这些交易(如果尚未达成)，以便在苹果设备上工作。 他们已经在iPad主页上安装了YouTube应用。

They obviously realize how big that is, a major situation, but it would be important, and so they’ve already taken care of it. I think that’ll happen more and more as we get a little closer maybe and they’ll have the major app for the main sites, and they’ll partner with those sites and they’ll be listed right on this page—YouTube, Facebook (maybe not MySpace), but other sites that people visit and they’re take care of that early.

他们显然意识到这是一个很大的情况，但这很重要，因此他们已经做好了准备。 我认为，随着我们之间距离越来越近，这种情况将会越来越多，它们将为主要网站提供主要应用程序，并且它们将与这些网站合作，并在此页面上列出它们，例如YouTube， Facebook(也许不是MySpace)，但是人们访问的其他网站很早就得到了照顾。

Kevin: So, why are we so ready to cast Flash aside, is what I’m thinking. If they had said, “Well, it will support Flash but it won’t support JavaScript.” I think there would be pandemonium, rioting in the streets. No one would buy this thing if it didn’t have JavaScript. Is it because Flash is not used for critical web stuff or is it because Flash is not an open standard?

凯文：那么，我们在想为什么要把Flash放在一边呢？ 如果他们说：“好吧，它将支持Flash，但不支持JavaScript。” 我认为街上会发生狂乱，骚乱。 如果没有JavaScript，没人会买这个东西。 是因为Flash不用于关键的Web内容，还是因为Flash不是开放标准？

What is it for you, Brad, that makes you ready to just sort of go, “Well, Flash, it can be a casualty.”

布拉德(Brad)，对您来说有什么用，让您随时可以开始，“好吧，快闪，这可能是一个伤亡者。”

Brad: I think it’s a little of both. I’m not a huge fan of Flash. We typically don’t use it on websites we build just because I know the limitations and this is a perfect example—why limit a possible user that could find your site on an iPhone or an iPad when you don’t have to just for some fancy little movie intro on your website.

布拉德：我认为两者都有。 我不是Flash的忠实粉丝。 通常，我们不会仅仅因为我知道局限性而在我们建的网站上使用它，这是一个完美的例子-为什么限制可能的用户在您不必仅仅为了某些目的而可以在iPhone或iPad上找到您的网站您网站上的小电影简介。

But, again, I do see kind of like we’re discussing here. I understand there are users out there that 90% of their web experience is Flash, whether it be games, whether it be videos on Hulu. So, I think it’s a critical piece of the Internet as far as entertainment. I don’t think it’s a critical piece from the professional side of it which is kind of the side I’m on. I’m kind of either way on it; I don’t depend on Flash myself but I know a lot of people do.

但是，我确实再次看到了我们在这里进行讨论的感觉。 我了解到那里有用户说他们90％的网络体验是Flash，无论是游戏还是Hulu上的视频。 因此，就娱乐而言，我认为它是互联网的重要组成部分。 我认为从专业角度来看，这不是关键的一环，而在我看来，这是至关重要的。 我在这上面有两种选择。 我自己不依赖Flash，但我知道很多人都依赖Flash。

Patrick: I don’t want to say the professional doesn’t matter but it kind of doesn’t matter. I don’t know. I think that this device isn’t going to be sold to the necessarily the hard core techie so much as a more general surfer. So, I think that’s why it’s so important—or at least why we’re talking about it—that is that if Flash works for it. I don’t know.

帕特里克(Patrick)：我不想说专业人士没关系，但没关系。 我不知道。 我认为该设备不会像更一般的冲浪者那样卖给必然的核心技术人员。 因此，我认为这就是为什么它如此重要(或者至少是我们在谈论它的原因)的原因，那就是Flash是否适用于它。 我不知道。

I know this podcast is aimed at the professional types but the professional types are, generally speaking, are just going to make adjustments and make their site work if they care about it all that much.

我知道此播客针对的是专业人士，但通常来说，如果他们非常关心专业人士，他们将进行调整并使其站点正常工作。

Kevin: But you’re right. Apple demoed this device sitting on a sofa. This is intended as a home sofa device. I’m sure there will be doctors and other people out there using this as a professional tablet with custom written software. But as far as using the functionality that ships in the box, I think it’s intended as a home user’s device.

凯文：但是你是对的。 苹果公司演示了坐在沙发上的该设备。 这旨在用作家用沙发设备。 我敢肯定会有医生和其他人使用它作为带有定制书面软件的专业平板电脑。 但是就使用包装盒中附带的功能而言，我认为它是作为家庭用户的设备使用的。

Stephan: I was just going to go into the history of Flash when you look at it right and you look at—okay, it started out as, “Ooohh… make cool intros and menus and things,” and then it turned into the best option out there for people to stream video. That’s why it’s been so pervasive, right? I mean it’s not because it’s been some great functionality adder to websites. It’s because…

史蒂芬(Stephan)：我只是想回顾一下Flash的历史，然后看看-好吧，它的开始是“哦……制作很酷的介绍，菜单和内容”，然后它变成了最好的Flash。人们可以选择在那里流式传输视频。 这就是为什么它如此普遍的对吧？ 我的意思是不是因为它是网站的一些很棒的功能添加器。 这是因为…

Kevin: God knows they’ve tried. They’ve definitely tried to position it that way. Things like Flex and even Air, to some extent, have been attempts to make Flash into an application development platform.

凯文：上帝知道他们已经尝试过了。 他们肯定试图那样定位。 在某种程度上，诸如Flex甚至Air之类的事情都在试图使Flash成为应用程序开发平台。

Stephan: Yeah, but they all required things that you had to install then on the desktop which was the beauty of it being built in to the browsers so they could stream video and you didn’t have to download anything extra, such as QuickTime stuff, and things like that.

斯蒂芬：是的，但是他们都需要先将其安装在桌面上，然后才能将它们内置到浏览器中，这样他们才可以流式传输视频，而无需下载其他任何东西，例如QuickTime东西，诸如此类。

Patrick: Flash’s installed base is definitely a plus, I think is what you’re saying.

帕特里克： Flash的安装基础绝对是加分项，我想这就是您要说的。

Stephan: Oh, yeah. That’s the thing is that it’s there. YouTube took advantage of that and they said, “Everyone’s already got this. Let’s just stream video through it.” I think maybe it’s going to be Flash’s downfall that they’re— It’s not as a great as everyone thought it was.

斯蒂芬：哦，是的。 那就是它在那里。 YouTube利用了这一优势，他们说：“每个人都已经知道了。 让我们通过它流式传输视频。” 我认为也许这将是Flash的失败-这并不像每个人都认为的那么伟大。

Kevin: Right. Yeah, video became Flash’s success story and they haven’t really found their next success story but the gloss is kind of fading on Flash videos as its success story because browsers are starting to deploy native support for video.

凯文：对。 是的，视频成为Flash的成功故事，他们还没有真正找到下一个成功故事，但是Flash视频作为其成功故事有点像褪色，因为浏览器已开始部署对视频的本机支持。

Safari and Chrome both support H.264 encoded video. Firefox supports Ogg Theora, which is an open standard for video encoding, which gives you lower quality at the same bandwidth but it is an open standard and that’s why they’re sticking with it, and the HTML5 standard for embedding video let’s you create a video tag that includes both versions and so you can surf all three of those browsers with no plug-ins as long as you encode those two versions of the video and provide them on your server.

Safari和Chrome均支持H.264编码的视频。 Firefox支持Ogg Theora，这是一种视频编码的开放标准，可以在相同带宽下为您提供较低的质量，但这是一种开放标准，这就是为什么他们坚持使用它，而嵌入视频HTML5标准让我们创建了包含两个版本的video标签，因此，只要您对这两个版本的视频进行编码并将其提供到服务器上，就可以在没有插件的情况下浏览所有这三个浏览器。

The more that becomes pervasive—and Internet Explorer, we’re looking at you—the more support those get, the less Flash becomes important as a video delivery mechanism.

越是普及的浏览器(Internet Explorer，我们正在寻找您)，获得的支持越多，Flash作为视频传输机制就越不重要。

I think Flash will continue to be used for a while, if only because of Internet Explorer, to deliver video but it’s no longer vital to have Flash because browsers like the one on the iPad are going to have native support for these HTML5 video. So, they can get away without Flash for video.

我认为Flash将会继续使用一段时间(即使仅由于Internet Explorer的缘故)才能提供视频，但是拥有Flash不再至关重要，因为iPad之类的浏览器将对这些HTML5视频提供本机支持。 因此，他们无需使用Flash即可观看视频。

Like I said, there seems to be no next really important thing that we need Flash for. If you listen to Apple, the reason they have not put Flash support in their mobile browser, in their mobile Safari browser, isn’t because it’s not essential; it’s not because people don’t want it; it’s because Adobe have been unable to deliver a Flash player that doesn’t suck the life out of a battery or cause the browser to crash.

就像我说的，似乎没有下一个我们需要Flash的真正重要的事情。 如果您听听Apple的声音，他们之所以没有在其移动浏览器和移动Safari浏览器中提供Flash支持，并不是因为它不是必需的；而是因为它不是必需的。 这不是因为人们不想要它。 这是因为Adobe无法提供不会耗尽电池寿命或导致浏览器崩溃的Flash Player。

Do we buy this or is this their convenient marketing?

我们买这个还是它们方便的营销？

Stephan: I think it’s a little bit of both. You look at the player for YouTube, how’d they do that? They’re pulling the video out of somewhere, right?

史蒂芬：我认为两者都有。 您看一下YouTube播放器，他们是怎么做到的？ 他们正在将视频拉出某个地方，对吧？

Kevin: Well, like Patrick said, they saw it as a vital component of web browsing so they got in touch with YouTube; YouTube agreed to send them a QuickTime stream, an H.264 stream, which they could play in a native video player that Apple built themselves.

凯文：好吧，就像帕特里克(Patrick)所说的那样，他们将其视为网络浏览的重要组成部分，因此可以与YouTube取得联系。 YouTube同意向他们发送QuickTime流(H.264流)，他们可以在Apple自己构建的本地视频播放器中播放。

They really went out of their way for that one. They’re not going to do that for every website out there and, in fact, this browser-native support for H.264 video is kind of the way of saying, “Any other site who wants to do what YouTube did on our phone? Here’s how you can do it.”

他们真的为那件事竭尽全力。 他们不会为每个网站都这样做，实际上，这种对H.264视频的浏览器本地支持就像是这样说：“任何其他网站都希望YouTube在我们的手机上做到这一点？ 这是您的方法。”

Stephan: I’m noticing more sites offering QuickTime videos, and maybe that’s the way to go. It’s interesting to watch this. I don’t think Apple is intentionally trying to kill Flash. They’re not out there to go we want see Flash dead, but they’re not going to go out of their way to make sure Flash succeeds.

史蒂芬(Stephan)：我注意到有更多网站提供QuickTime视频，也许这就是要走的路。 看着这个很有趣。 我认为苹果并不是故意杀死Flash。 他们并没有离开那里，我们希望看到Flash死亡，但他们不会竭尽全力确保Flash成功。

Kevin: There are plenty of Flash fans out there who are saying that’s exactly what Apple’s doing, though. They say, “Look, Flash is great and it is a powerful platform and it has super slick and easy to use developer tools. Apple doesn’t want to put it on their device because it competes with their super slick development tools for their closed App Store.”

凯文(Kevin)：尽管有很多Flash粉丝说这正是苹果公司正在做的事情。 他们说：“您看，Flash很棒，它是一个功能强大的平台，它具有超级流畅且易于使用的开发人员工具。 Apple不想将其放在设备上，因为它与封闭式App Store的超级光滑开发工具竞争。”

Stephan: But see this is a terrible argument because people who invented cars didn’t intend on putting the blacksmith out of business. That wasn’t their goal. Their goal was to make transportation easier, right? And it just happened that blacksmith had to go out of business because they couldn’t horseshoes anymore. It’s just a casualty.

斯蒂芬：但是看到这是一个可怕的论据，因为发明汽车的人并不想把铁匠关门。 那不是他们的目标。 他们的目标是使交通更轻松，对吗？ 碰巧的是，铁匠不得不倒闭，因为他们再也不能用铁蹄了。 这只是一个伤亡。

Patrick: But we mourn the loss of the blacksmith.

帕特里克：但我们为铁匠的流失感到哀悼。

Stephan: We do.

史蒂芬：我们做。

Patrick: I’m just kidding.

帕特里克：我只是在开玩笑。

Kevin: If you look at Flash on the Web as an application platform competing with Apple’s App Store, then is Apple guilty of unfair competition by saying “Well, we’re going to win that fight simply by cutting Flash out of our browser experience.” I don’t think so. I don’t think applications belonged in my web browser to begin with, to be honest.

凯文(Kevin)：如果您将Flash作为与Apple App Store竞争的应用程序平台在网络上看待，则Apple犯有不公平竞争的罪行，他说：“好吧，我们将通过从我们的浏览器体验中删除Flash来赢得这场战斗。 ” 我不这么认为。 老实说，我不认为应用程序属于我的网络浏览器。

Stephan: That’s a professional answer. (laugh)

史蒂芬：那是一个专业的答案。 (笑)

Kevin: (laugh) Well, this is something I’ve felt for a long time like the web should be—uugghhh, I’m going to sound like, “Get off my lawn here.” But for me the web has always been at its best an interlinked collection of documents. It’s a publishing platform. Applications got thrown in there just because everyone has a web browser and people wanted to build applications that everyone could use without having to install them and every other attempt to deploy an application platform, ubiquitous enough to do that has failed and so people misused HTML and JavaScript to build things like Gmail and Google Docs and things like that, these desktop-like applications that live within a web page.

凯文：(笑)嗯，这是我很长一段时间以来一直都感觉像网络应该的感觉—嗯，我听起来像是“从这里草坪上下来。” 但是对我来说，网络一直是充其量是一个相互关联的文档集合。 这是一个发布平台。 应用程序之所以被扔到那里是因为每个人都有一个Web浏览器，人们想要构建每个人都可以使用而不必安装它们的应用程序，也没有其他尝试来部署应用程序平台的尝试，这种情况无处不在，以至于失败了，因此人们滥用HTML和JavaScript可以构建Gmail和Google Docs之类的东西，以及诸如此类的东西，它们驻留在网页中，类似于桌面。

I think what Apple is doing is they’re saying. “We don’t think the Web should be like that either.” Their browser for the iPhone, their browser for the iPad is not optimized for things like that. If you think you’re going to be able to use Gmail happily, the web version of Gmail happily in your iPad browser you’re kidding yourself. The iPad browser is all about zooming to columns of text to make them easy to read and it’s not about hitting little toolbar buttons in your Gmail text editor to make things bold.

我认为Apple在说什么。 “我们也不认为网络也应该那样。” 他们针对iPhone的浏览器，针对iPad的浏览器并未针对此类情况进行优化。 如果您认为自己可以愉快地使用Gmail，那么iPad版本的浏览器中可以愉快地使用Gmail的Web版本就是在自欺欺人。 iPad浏览器的全部作用是放大文本列以使其易于阅读，而不是在Gmail文本编辑器中单击工具栏上的小按钮以使其变粗体。

Apple’s answer to that is native applications. I’m wondering if the iPad is going to lead this exodus of web apps that should have never been web apps and make them into native apps for things like the iPad, things for the Google Android platform and whatever other hopefully more and more ubiquitous application platforms appear.

苹果对此的回答是本机应用程序。 我想知道iPad是否会领导本不该成为网络应用的网络应用大潮，并将它们转变为iPad，Google Android平台之类的本机应用，以及其他希望越来越普遍的应用平台出现。

Stephan: We can hope.

史蒂芬：我们可以希望。

Kevin: I’m hoping against hope.

凯文：我希望没有希望。

Patrick: So what’s the comparable point for the desktop, I guess? Is it every single platform needs native apps if we keep it out of the browser? So you have the app for the iPad, iPhone, iTouch, you have the app for Android, you have the app for Blackberry, I suppose and then you have the desktop Mac, PC, different browsers. Does everything need an app? I mean does that go against the idea of open standards that some of us promote where it works on browsers? I mean how far should we take that notion of native apps?

帕特里克：那我认为台式机的可比性是什么？ 如果我们将其排除在浏览器之外，是否每个平台都需要本机应用程序？ 因此，假设您拥有适用于iPad，iPhone，iTouch的应用程序，拥有适用于Android的应用程序，拥有适用于Blackberry的应用程序，我想您应该拥有台式机Mac，PC和其他浏览器。 一切都需要一个应用程序吗？ 我的意思是说这与我们中的一些人在浏览器上推广的开放标准背道而驰吗？ 我的意思是我们应该把原生应用程序的概念走多远？

Kevin: Well, I think there’s a whole spectrum. I mean I have to applaud Adobe for what they’ve done with the AIR platform. They’ve tried to provide an internet installable, ubiquitous app platform in Adobe AIR where you can write apps and they can run on all these desktop operating systems. The fact is that every time you do that, every time you do something more cross-platform you have something less native and with less of the convenience features that you’re used to in the truly native apps for your platforms. So if you’re a Mac user, a lot of AIR apps are not going to feel quite right compared to their native Mac equivalents.

凯文：嗯，我认为范围很广。 I mean I have to applaud Adobe for what they've done with the AIR platform. They've tried to provide an internet installable, ubiquitous app platform in Adobe AIR where you can write apps and they can run on all these desktop operating systems. The fact is that every time you do that, every time you do something more cross-platform you have something less native and with less of the convenience features that you're used to in the truly native apps for your platforms. So if you're a Mac user, a lot of AIR apps are not going to feel quite right compared to their native Mac equivalents.

But you’re right, Patrick; we can’t expect anyone who has something useful as an app to write a Windows version, a Mac version, an iPad version and whatever other versions are out there but people are doing that. I mean you look at something like Evernote which is a note taking platform that you can take everywhere—they market it as “your external brain”—and what they’ve done is they’ve built an iPhone version, they’ve built an Android version, they’ve got a Windows version and a Mac version and each of them is written from scratch to take advantage of the strengths of those platforms.

But you're right, Patrick; we can't expect anyone who has something useful as an app to write a Windows version, a Mac version, an iPad version and whatever other versions are out there but people are doing that. I mean you look at something like Evernote which is a note taking platform that you can take everywhere—they market it as “your external brain”—and what they've done is they've built an iPhone version, they've built an Android version, they've got a Windows version and a Mac version and each of them is written from scratch to take advantage of the strengths of those platforms.

Stephan: And it is using a standard in the background, right?

Stephan: And it is using a standard in the background, right?

Kevin: Yes.

凯文：是的。

Stephan: Maybe that’s the secret, right? I mean we’re going to come back to web services?

Stephan: Maybe that's the secret, right? I mean we're going to come back to web services?

Kevin: It is a lot to ask if you want to play in the app ecosystem today. Do you have to write four native apps to get noticed? It is a lot to ask because each of those platforms is very different from a developer standpoint. I will grant you that. megaupload movies

Kevin: It is a lot to ask if you want to play in the app ecosystem today. Do you have to write four native apps to get noticed? It is a lot to ask because each of those platforms is very different from a developer standpoint. I will grant you that. megaupload movies

To close this off, I have a question. If you were Adobe, what would you do? What is your play here? If we take for granted the fact that Flash isn’t going to get on to this device and people are going to buy it anyway, what’s your move?

To close this off, I have a question. If you were Adobe, what would you do? What is your play here? If we take for granted the fact that Flash isn't going to get on to this device and people are going to buy it anyway, what's your move?

My move if I’m Adobe is to move on. Build developer tools for the web technologies that people are moving to. If people are dropping Flash, I mean Adobe doesn’t make money off of people installing the Flash Player. They make money off of people buying the Flash Development Environment. But they also have Dreamweaver; they also have things like Illustrator which I think the next version is going to be able to export to HTML5 canvas. So invest more in those things.

My move if I'm Adobe is to move on. Build developer tools for the web technologies that people are moving to. If people are dropping Flash, I mean Adobe doesn't make money off of people installing the Flash Player. They make money off of people buying the Flash Development Environment. But they also have Dreamweaver; they also have things like Illustrator which I think the next version is going to be able to export to HTML5 canvas. So invest more in those things.

Stephan: I agree. I say checkmate Apple and move on.

史蒂芬：我同意。 I say checkmate Apple and move on.

Patrick: That’s giving Apple a lot of power. A little too much. They’re not even the majority on the desktop.

Patrick: That's giving Apple a lot of power. A little too much. They're not even the majority on the desktop.

Kevin: It is but what we’re saying is not that Adobe should become a creator of developer tools for Apple’s platform. I think they need to go open.

Kevin: It is but what we're saying is not that Adobe should become a creator of developer tools for Apple's platform. I think they need to go open.

Patrick: Focus on the things that make them money. Flash doesn’t make them money.

Patrick: Focus on the things that make them money. Flash doesn't make them money.

Kevin: No, that’s true.

Kevin: No, that's true.

Stephan: So why not focus your business on, I think what they see Flash as is something to get their name out there, right? People know Adobe because of Flash. You ask someone if they know who Adobe is; they’re not going to know it from Lightroom. If I told someone I use Lightroom, they’re going to go, “What’s that?” unless they’re a photographer but I tell them, “Oh, you know that Flash Video.” “Oh Adobe, okay.” That makes sense to people. So I think that they’re counting on those people remembering the Adobe name and I really don’t think it makes them as much money as they want.

Stephan: So why not focus your business on, I think what they see Flash as is something to get their name out there, right? People know Adobe because of Flash. You ask someone if they know who Adobe is; they're not going to know it from Lightroom. If I told someone I use Lightroom, they're going to go, “What's that?” unless they're a photographer but I tell them, “Oh, you know that Flash Video.” “Oh Adobe, okay.” That makes sense to people. So I think that they're counting on those people remembering the Adobe name and I really don't think it makes them as much money as they want.

Kevin: Well the moneymaking attempt they made, they wanted to be where Apple is with their App Store. They wanted to get the Flash Player out there everywhere so that people could then buy applications built on things like Adobe AIR, although I’m not sure anyone has ever spent a penny on an Adobe AIR app, but that was their vision and then they would be selling the top-of-class development tools for that platform.

Kevin: Well the moneymaking attempt they made, they wanted to be where Apple is with their App Store. They wanted to get the Flash Player out there everywhere so that people could then buy applications built on things like Adobe AIR, although I'm not sure anyone has ever spent a penny on an Adobe AIR app, but that was their vision and then they would be selling the top-of-class development tools for that platform.

Patrick: Right. They make money with their Flash development tools and selling Creative Suite, which I believe probably has Flash in it. It did when I bought it. So you know there’s money being made but this isn’t to say that Adobe is in any trouble as a company. It’s not like there is Real Player or anything. I mean they are a healthy company, not to slam Real Player or like I don’t know; I’m old school and all that. I have some love for the past but at the same time, it’s like they’re a healthy company, they have great products, they have leading products like Creative Suite, like Dreamweaver like you said, like Photoshop obviously. So they’ll be fine. They’ll have to innovate or die I think as an Adobe person said on his blog—John Nack said that, and I think that’s the case with most products and we’ll see what they do from here and for all it’ll be better for it.

帕特里克：对。 They make money with their Flash development tools and selling Creative Suite, which I believe probably has Flash in it. It did when I bought it. So you know there's money being made but this isn't to say that Adobe is in any trouble as a company. It's not like there is Real Player or anything. I mean they are a healthy company, not to slam Real Player or like I don't know; I'm old school and all that. I have some love for the past but at the same time, it's like they're a healthy company, they have great products, they have leading products like Creative Suite, like Dreamweaver like you said, like Photoshop obviously. So they'll be fine. They'll have to innovate or die I think as an Adobe person said on his blog— John Nack said that , and I think that's the case with most products and we'll see what they do from here and for all it'll be better for it.

Kevin: I don’t think Flash is dead as an application development tool. They’re doing nice things with Flash CS5’s app exporter so you can build iPhone native apps based on a Flash application that you’ve developed. I think if they really work hard at making that good and making the apps that it generates highly performance apps with really nice interfaces. I think they might be able to get some leverage there, but apart from that exception, I think they really need to be refocusing on their strengths.

Kevin: I don't think Flash is dead as an application development tool. They're doing nice things with Flash CS5's app exporter so you can build iPhone native apps based on a Flash application that you've developed. I think if they really work hard at making that good and making the apps that it generates highly performance apps with really nice interfaces. I think they might be able to get some leverage there, but apart from that exception, I think they really need to be refocusing on their strengths.

I think you’re right Stephan—checkmate. The game is over for trying to be for the big ubiquitous app platform. That’s just not Adobe’s strength, that not what they’re good at, much as they’ve tried.

I think you're right Stephan—checkmate. The game is over for trying to be for the big ubiquitous app platform. That's just not Adobe's strength, that not what they're good at, much as they've tried.

On a lighter note, I think we need to bring the tone up here with our host spotlights guys.

On a lighter note, I think we need to bring the tone up here with our host spotlights guys.

Stephan, what have you got for us?

Stephan, what have you got for us?

Stephan: I actually have something related. I was going to mention this earlier. I have something related to video in HTML5. It’s the Sublime Video Library, I guess it’s what you can call it. It’s a native HTML5 video player for HTML5 with no browser plug-in and no Flash dependencies and it supports Firefox, Safari, and Google Chrome. If there’s Internet Explorer, it falls back to Flash, which is pretty cool. It’s really neat. You can find that it’s done by Jilion, I think is how you say it; it’s a company somewhere in Europe. Looks like it’s pretty good work.

Stephan: I actually have something related. I was going to mention this earlier. I have something related to video in HTML5. It's the Sublime Video Library , I guess it's what you can call it. It's a native HTML5 video player for HTML5 with no browser plug-in and no Flash dependencies and it supports Firefox, Safari, and Google Chrome. If there's Internet Explorer, it falls back to Flash, which is pretty cool. It's really neat. You can find that it's done by Jilion, I think is how you say it; it's a company somewhere in Europe. Looks like it's pretty good work.

Patrick: It actually doesn’t support Firefox, yet.

Patrick: It actually doesn't support Firefox, yet.

Stephan: Oh, it doesn’t.

Stephan: Oh, it doesn't.

Patrick: They plan to add it. Right now, they only support Safari 4.0.4+, Chrome 4.0+, and IE with Google Frame which is IE with Google Chrome installed in it. Those are where it’s going right now, but they do plan to have Firefox support, and as you said, IE support by falling back to Flash, but I did want to take a look at it, but I couldn’t in my Firefox.

Patrick: They plan to add it. Right now, they only support Safari 4.0.4+, Chrome 4.0+, and IE with Google Frame which is IE with Google Chrome installed in it. Those are where it's going right now, but they do plan to have Firefox support, and as you said, IE support by falling back to Flash, but I did want to take a look at it, but I couldn't in my Firefox.

Stephan: I played with it a little bit today. It definitely has some bugs to it. It’s a little laggy. I’m guessing they’re still working on the streaming part of it, so maybe it’s just a latency thing on their end.

Stephan: I played with it a little bit today. It definitely has some bugs to it. It's a little laggy. I'm guessing they're still working on the streaming part of it, so maybe it's just a latency thing on their end.

Patrick: It won’t be coming to YouTube anytime soon, I guess.

Patrick: It won't be coming to YouTube anytime soon, I guess.

Stephan: Yeah, it’s not the next YouTube. It’s not ready.

Stephan: Yeah, it's not the next YouTube. 还没准备好

Kevin: It’s brand new. This was actually going to be my host spotlight as well, Stephan…

Kevin: It's brand new. This was actually going to be my host spotlight as well, Stephan…

Stephan: Haha—beat ya! Yesss!

Stephan: Haha—beat ya! Yesss!

Kevin: …and then when I saw you posted, I went “Noooooooo!” It’s early days—like it’s just been announced—and as a preview of what’s to come, it is super impressive. It’s really slick. If you do one thing with this demo, go to it in a browser that supports it (so Chrome or Safari) and start playing the video and then click the full screen button. It actually animates to fill your browser window, as the background sort of fades back as you get with some of these lightbox extensions for viewing slideshows. It is super, super slick.

Kevin: …and then when I saw you posted, I went “Noooooooo!” It's early days—like it's just been announced—and as a preview of what's to come, it is super impressive. It's really slick. If you do one thing with this demo, go to it in a browser that supports it (so Chrome or Safari) and start playing the video and then click the full screen button. It actually animates to fill your browser window, as the background sort of fades back as you get with some of these lightbox extensions for viewing slideshows. It is super, super slick.

Looking at some of the stuff people have written about it, it does really impressive things that—people were worried about that the native HTML5 video tag, one of the things it does, at least in the current version of the spec, is it auto buffers. Even if you go to a page that has a video on it and you don’t plan to watch that video, your browser starts downloading the video anyway, which is kind of a failing compared to some of the Flash players that you get out there, but what’s Sublime Video has managed to do here with some JavaScript trickery is make it so that the video doesn’t start downloading until you actually said I want to start watching it now.

Looking at some of the stuff people have written about it, it does really impressive things that—people were worried about that the native HTML5 video tag, one of the things it does, at least in the current version of the spec, is it auto buffers. Even if you go to a page that has a video on it and you don't plan to watch that video, your browser starts downloading the video anyway, which is kind of a failing compared to some of the Flash players that you get out there, but what's Sublime Video has managed to do here with some JavaScript trickery is make it so that the video doesn't start downloading until you actually said I want to start watching it now.

It’s really beautiful and they’ve kind of take in the base platform of the HTML5 video tag and built on top of it and shown really what’s possible.

It's really beautiful and they've kind of take in the base platform of the HTML5 video tag and built on top of it and shown really what's possible.

So yeah, when the public version comes out with Firefox support and Flash fallback support, it’s going to be really, really great.

So yeah, when the public version comes out with Firefox support and Flash fallback support, it's going to be really, really great.

Brad, what’s your spotlight?

Brad, what's your spotlight?

Brad: My host spotlight this week is WhatBrowser.org and it does pretty much exactly what you would think. It tells you what browser you’re running. It’s a site that was set up by Google, some of the techies over at Google. It’s great for clients or maybe family members when you’re trying to figure out what browser they’re in, rather than try to walk them through what menu to go through and finding the About box, send them to WhatBrowser.org and it will pop up and tell you exactly what browser they’re running with the version.

Brad: My host spotlight this week is WhatBrowser.org and it does pretty much exactly what you would think. It tells you what browser you're running. It's a site that was set up by Google, some of the techies over at Google. It's great for clients or maybe family members when you're trying to figure out what browser they're in, rather than try to walk them through what menu to go through and finding the About box, send them to WhatBrowser.org and it will pop up and tell you exactly what browser they're running with the version.

It has some information about browsers too, so there’s a link that says a few useful tweaks and if you click on that, this will be tailored based on the browser you’re running; it will show you some very basic stuff—how to change your homepage, how to change your search engine, how to set your default browser.

It has some information about browsers too, so there's a link that says a few useful tweaks and if you click on that, this will be tailored based on the browser you're running; it will show you some very basic stuff—how to change your homepage, how to change your search engine, how to set your default browser.

Kevin: Wow, that’s cool.

Kevin: Wow, that's cool.

Brad: It’s kind of nice. Send it over to like a newbie that doesn’t really know what they’re doing and it will just make it a little bit easier on you. I’ve been using it quite a bit lately. It’s a nice little tool.

Brad: It's kind of nice. Send it over to like a newbie that doesn't really know what they're doing and it will just make it a little bit easier on you. I've been using it quite a bit lately. It's a nice little tool.

Patrick: I noticed that it says “try a new browser” down there and it has Firefox, Chrome, and IE. I wonder how other people feel about that.

Patrick: I noticed that it says “try a new browser” down there and it has Firefox, Chrome, and IE. I wonder how other people feel about that.

Brad: Yeah, it has all the browsers and stuff. It even has Opera listed first, which is interesting.

Brad: Yeah, it has all the browsers and stuff. It even has Opera listed first, which is interesting.

I think we’ve mentioned this on the previous show how anytime Google kind of promotes using a different browser, they never put Chrome first; they always put Chrome second, or third, or fourth, which is kind of odd. You would expect them to put Chrome at the front, but they have all the different browsers here that you can download and check out.

I think we've mentioned this on the previous show how anytime Google kind of promotes using a different browser, they never put Chrome first; they always put Chrome second, or third, or fourth, which is kind of odd. You would expect them to put Chrome at the front, but they have all the different browsers here that you can download and check out.

Stephan: Patrick, when you guys on Windows click on the “try a new browser,” does it actually give you an option to download Internet Explorer?

Stephan: Patrick, when you guys on Windows click on the “try a new browser,” does it actually give you an option to download Internet Explorer?

Patrick: No, it just goes to a second page. On the first page, all I get is Firefox, Chrome, and IE and then if you click on it, then it takes you to another page where you get linked to Opera, Chrome, Firefox, IE, Safari in that order.

Patrick: No, it just goes to a second page. On the first page, all I get is Firefox, Chrome, and IE and then if you click on it, then it takes you to another page where you get linked to Opera, Chrome, Firefox, IE, Safari in that order.

Stephan: Okay, so they do link to IE, though. I was just wondering if they just had—because on the Mac, they don’t even show the Internet Explorer. They just show the the “try a new browser,” and then there’s no link to Internet Explorer.

Stephan: Okay, so they do link to IE, though. I was just wondering if they just had—because on the Mac, they don't even show the Internet Explorer. They just show the the “try a new browser,” and then there's no link to Internet Explorer.

Kevin: I bet some of Google’s corporate support people are going to be making use of this soon. “Oh, see—the problem you have there is you’re using Internet Explorer 6, and we don’t support that anymore.”

Kevin: I bet some of Google's corporate support people are going to be making use of this soon. “Oh, see—the problem you have there is you're using Internet Explorer 6, and we don't support that anymore.”

Brad: I’m sure they’re using this site quite a bit.

Brad: I'm sure they're using this site quite a bit.

Kevin: My spotlight is the SitePoint CSS Reference, which was just updated this week with all new browser compatibility tables. Internet Explorer 7 and 8, Chrome 4 all of that is now fully covered and great work to the two authors who put that together, Paul O’Brien and Tommy Olsson. Great work guys. Really excited to have that reference back up to date and it’s completely free at reference.sitepoint.com.

Kevin: My spotlight is the SitePoint CSS Reference , which was just updated this week with all new browser compatibility tables. Internet Explorer 7 and 8, Chrome 4 all of that is now fully covered and great work to the two authors who put that together, Paul O'Brien and Tommy Olsson. Great work guys. Really excited to have that reference back up to date and it's completely free at reference.sitepoint.com.

Patrick?

帕特里克？

Patrick: Yes, I pull up the rear today. My site is wezen-ball.com. It will be linked on the podcast site to make it easy. Larry Granillo—author at the site—he’s calculating the stats of Charlie Brown from the Peanuts comic strip.

Patrick: Yes, I pull up the rear today. My site is wezen-ball.com . It will be linked on the podcast site to make it easy. Larry Granillo—author at the site—he's calculating the stats of Charlie Brown from the Peanuts comic strip.

He’s going through each Peanut comic strip for baseball stats—the wins, the losses of Charlie Brown and assorted other details, highlights of the games, the first time something happened, and… Wins or losses are the big one, but there’s a lot of general interesting factoids in the—

He's going through each Peanut comic strip for baseball stats—the wins, the losses of Charlie Brown and assorted other details, highlights of the games, the first time something happened, and… Wins or losses are the big one, but there's a lot of general interesting factoids in the—

Kevin: Did he ever win?

Kevin: Did he ever win?

Patrick: Right now, Granillo has done the 1950s and the 1960s with more to come. Right now, for the 1960s, it’s a losing record. It’s very bad, and I’m trying to pull it up, but the site is moving slowly, but he’s definitely not, as you might imagine, a winner.

Patrick: Right now, Granillo has done the 1950s and the 1960s with more to come. Right now, for the 1960s, it's a losing record. It's very bad, and I'm trying to pull it up, but the site is moving slowly, but he's definitely not, as you might imagine, a winner.

He also tracks a number of times that he’s been knocked off the mound by a line drive.

He also tracks a number of times that he's been knocked off the mound by a line drive.

It’s just a really fun piece, although research in a serious manner, but it’s a great read and really one of the great little—just one of those pieces that is just fun to read.

It's just a really fun piece, although research in a serious manner, but it's a great read and really one of the great little—just one of those pieces that is just fun to read.

Kevin: Well thank you Patrick. I saved yours for last because I knew it would be fun.

Kevin: Well thank you Patrick. I saved yours for last because I knew it would be fun.

Patrick: (laugh)

Patrick: (laugh)

Kevin: So that brings another episode of the SitePoint Podcast to a close. Guys?

Kevin: So that brings another episode of the SitePoint Podcast to a close. Guys?

Brad: I’m Brad Williams with WebDevStudios and you can find me on Twitter @williamsba.

Brad: I'm Brad Williams with WebDevStudios and you can find me on Twitter @williamsba .

Patrick: I’m Patrick O’Keefe of the iFroggy network, on Twitter @iFroggy.

Patrick: I'm Patrick O'Keefe of the iFroggy network , on Twitter @iFroggy .

Stephan: I’m Stephan Seagraves. You can find me on Twitter @sseagraves or read the blog at badice.com.

斯蒂芬：我是斯蒂芬·海格雷夫斯。 You can find me on Twitter @sseagraves or read the blog at badice.com .

Kevin: And you can follow me on Twitter @sentience and you can follow SitePoint on Twitter @sitepointdotcom. Visit the SitePoint Podcast at sitepoint.com/podcast to leave comments on the show.

Kevin: And you can follow me on Twitter @sentience and you can follow SitePoint on Twitter @sitepointdotcom . Visit the SitePoint Podcast at sitepoint.com/podcast to leave comments on the show.

The last giveaway we did—the SitePoint PDF of your choice giveaway for an iTunes review—was really successful, so we’re doing it again.

The last giveaway we did—the SitePoint PDF of your choice giveaway for an iTunes review—was really successful, so we're doing it again.

If you want to win yourself a free copy of the SitePoint book of your choice in PDF format, simply go to the iTunes Store that you use and leave a review on the SitePoint Podcast. This helps us promote the show and gain rank in the iTunes podcast directory. So you could really help us out with that and once you’ve left that review, come back to the SitePoint Podcast and copy and paste your review in as a comment, so we know that you’ve left it. We will then award a free PDF to someone.

If you want to win yourself a free copy of the SitePoint book of your choice in PDF format, simply go to the iTunes Store that you use and leave a review on the SitePoint Podcast. This helps us promote the show and gain rank in the iTunes podcast directory. So you could really help us out with that and once you've left that review, come back to the SitePoint Podcast and copy and paste your review in as a comment, so we know that you've left it. We will then award a free PDF to someone.

Hey, the odds were really good last time, I’ll be honest with you. If you left a review, you were in a handful of people in the running. Definitely do it, and you’ll be surprised at just how lucky you might be.

Hey, the odds were really good last time, I'll be honest with you. If you left a review, you were in a handful of people in the running. Definitely do it, and you'll be surprised at just how lucky you might be.

So that’s it. The SitePoint podcast is produced by Carl Longnecker and I’m Kevin Yank.

就是这样了。 The SitePoint podcast is produced by Carl Longnecker and I'm Kevin Yank.

Thanks as always for listening. Bye bye.

Thanks as always for listening. 再见。

Theme music by Mike Mella.

Mike Mella的主题音乐。

Thanks for listening! Feel free to let us know how we’re doing, or to continue the discussion, using the comments field below.

谢谢收听！ 欢迎使用下面的评论字段让我们知道我们的状况，或者继续讨论。

翻译自: https://www.sitepoint.com/podcast-47-checkmate-apple/